New Surface users vs. old

[megatronium]

The i7 SP3 will be my first Surface PC. I've lurked these forums for the past month and I must say that the amount of negativity concerning SP3 is a bit alarming. I'm a multimedia artist (premiere, Photoshop, flash, etc.) and the SP3 looks to be what I've always dreamed of. I find myself counting down the days till release. Anyway, it seems to me that the negativity surrounding SP3 is coming mostly from former Surface users (sp2, 1). Is that a fair assessment? As a new Surface user should I be concerned? I'm replacing a Samsung rf510 with a 1st gen i7 and a CyanogenMod HP Touchpad. I'm excited about the upgrade but this forum is bumming me out. Is this the most active Surface forum on the net? I also check out Surfaceproartist. Thanks!

 

[mcsenerd]

I think there's something to that, namely because I believe that many (prematurely) expected the logical progression of the next gen surface pro to further extend the performance abilities of the prior generation, however this wasn't to be the case. Look, the SP3 is a fine laplet, ultratab, tabtop, or whatever hybrid word you'd like to describe it with, but in several ways it IS a step back from what the SP2 brought to the table. That in no way diminishes the superb machine that is the SP3, nor does it discount in any fashion the many other areas where the SP3 clearly outpaces the prior two devices. It is not in every case a clear upgrade over the SP2 though. I, like many, do believe that this form factor is screaming for silicon that's just not available yet.

 

[megatronium]

I think there's something to that, namely because I believe that many (prematurely) expected the logical progression of the next gen surface pro to further extend the performance abilities of the prior generation, however this wasn't to be the case. Look, the SP3 is a fine laplet, ultratab, tabtop, or whatever hybrid word you'd like to describe it with, but in several ways it IS a step back from what the SP2 brought to the table. That in no way diminishes the superb machine that is the SP3, nor does it discount in any fashion the many other areas where the SP3 clearly outpaces the prior two devices. It is not in every case a clear upgrade over the SP2 though. I, like many, do believe that this form factor is screaming for silicon that's just not available yet.

I've read that Broadwell will have pretty much the same performance as Haswell when it comes to mobile. With that in mind, aren't those waiting for newer CPU setting themselves up for failure? Perhaps this is as far as we can go for a while without a dedicated GPU which
doesnt seem possible with this form factor and battery life (see Razer Blade Pro).

 

[benjitek]

...As a new Surface user should I be concerned?...

Nah -- but you should buy from some place where your SP3 can be easily exchanged or returned should you run into issues, or decide it's not the best option for you.

 

[Geneo]

It's not perfect, but what computer is? However, I'm quite surprised and happy with it. I'm having more trouble with Win 8.1 (coming from OSX) than anything, but that's not the Surface's problem. I'm getting used to it though.

You have to remember that the vast majority aren't having any problems. Of course, when some people do have problems, they search this forum out and air them here, so reading threads here is kinda one sided. I've read several dozens of reviews and the biggest complaint is that the type cover isn't included (circles finger in the air).

 

[cdf3]

I enjoy using my Surface Pro 3. Even though I still have my Surface Pro 2, I no longer use it. Plan on giving it to a family member. You will come across posts where users have legitimate claims on issues they are having. Sometimes it could be caused by the Surface Pro 3 itself, or Windows 8.1 could have something to do with it as well. I remember when I first got my Surface Pro 2, my screen kept flickering and the device kept locking up. I was ready to take it back. Come to find out. It was a desktop app I installed from my previous laptop that wasn't compatible with Windows 8.1. Even changing the compatibility mode settings of the app didn't help. I saw where they had an updated version that supported Windows 8.1. I was good to go after that.
There are quite a few users that have posted positive comments about their user user experience. I've also noticed there are a lot of unhappy Surface Pro 1 and 2 users that are unhappy their device had been outdated less than a year after they have purchased it. Some are trolling the Pro 3 because they can't upgrade. I was a little hot as well. Just purchased my Pro 2 a few months ago, now it's outdated. I went ahead and bit the bullet because the Pro 3 experience has been better. Also take a look at sites like BestBuy, and read their user reviews. You will find a lot of happy users that actually own the device. Not just previous Surface Pro owners that don't own the Pro 3, go to the store and play around with a demo unit, then come back and bash it like they actually own it.

 

[ctitanic]

I think there's something to that, namely because I believe that many (prematurely) expected the logical progression of the next gen surface pro to further extend the performance abilities of the prior generation, however this wasn't to be the case. Look, the SP3 is a fine laplet, ultratab, tabtop, or whatever hybrid word you'd like to describe it with, but in several ways it IS a step back from what the SP2 brought to the table. That in no way diminishes the superb machine that is the SP3, nor does it discount in any fashion the many other areas where the SP3 clearly outpaces the prior two devices. It is not in every case a clear upgrade over the SP2 though. I, like many, do believe that this form factor is screaming for silicon that's just not available yet.

Well, I don't see it as steps back. They are just different machines with different configuration. To achieve some new features sometimes you have to give up on some old ones that are not that important for the majority. Of course, that the minority will complain about it. But that's it. You have to keep in mind that when there is a question or issue people go to forums. There are few happy ones that come to forums to express their experience.

 

[ctitanic]

The i7 SP3 will be my first Surface PC. I've lurked these forums for the past month and I must say that the amount of negativity concerning SP3 is a bit alarming. I'm a multimedia artist (premiere, Photoshop, flash, etc.) and the SP3 looks to be what I've always dreamed of. I find myself counting down the days till release. Anyway, it seems to me that the negativity surrounding SP3 is coming mostly from former Surface users (sp2, 1). Is that a fair assessment? As a new Surface user should I be concerned? I'm replacing a Samsung rf510 with a 1st gen i7 and a CyanogenMod HP Touchpad. I'm excited about the upgrade but this forum is bumming me out. Is this the most active Surface forum on the net? I also check out Surfaceproartist. Thanks!

You should check your actual needs against what the Surface Pro 3 brings to you. If once that's done you got a winner go for it. You will not regret it. This is a wonderful machine and so far everything that I have seen, experienced, can be fixed by MS and they are really not show Stoppers.

 

[mcsenerd]

I've said before and I'll hold pretty tough to it... The SP3 "upgrade" is in many ways very similar to what occurred for Apple when they introduced the first "Retina" display in the iPads. Although this increase in screen resolution had real and tangible benefits to many, it WAS a trade-off in terms of performance for what the processing power at the time could provide. Thus, the 4th Gen of the iPad became the "true" successor to the iPad 2. I feel that the SP3 is very similar to this situation. While many of the changes can be considered improvements to a great many, the fact is that they came at a cost... namely performance and thermal design (don't know if those can be divorced anyway). Like the iPad 3rd generation, this in no way makes the SP3 some sort of poor design or bad machine, but it most certainly does lead one to believe that the "ideal" device is still down the road. The SP3 in my mind is a leading machine... ahead of the curve and trying to stretch other PC makers to come up with new, better, and more inspiring designs. Therefore, it might always be a little too soon or a little too ahead of things, but that's fine to me. I don't use the SP2 anymore even though I still have it sitting here in the house, but that's only because I don't game on this device and my workload does not require some inordinate amount of processing or GPU prowess. If I need to use virtualization, then I'll do it remotely on hardware that was designed for it. If I need to game, then I'll do it on a system that was designed to do so. I feel the SP3 is a general computing device and I use it as such.

Will Braswell bring the SP4 or whatever it will be when it arrives to some sort of happy place involving thermal efficiency and power? I don't know, but it certainly can't hurt. I get how many are thinking that it won't be a huge upgrade... but if the reality is that it is the thermal load on the system holding the SP3 back today and Braswell brings about more thermal efficiency, then isn't it logical to believe that while the chip itself might not offer significant upgrades in terms of raw processing power that it might be able to more closely achieve the maximum amount of that performance where today that is not possible due to constrained thermal loads?

I love the SP3 and I'm not getting rid of mine, but I am certainly excited about what the future holds for the device as advances are made in efficiencies and mobile GPU power.

 

[mcsenerd]

I've read that Broadwell will have pretty much the same performance as Haswell when it comes to mobile. With that in mind, aren't those waiting for newer CPU setting themselves up for failure? Perhaps this is as far as we can go for a while without a dedicated GPU which
doesnt seem possible with this form factor and battery life (see Razer Blade Pro).

That might be possible, but I think many are stretching or embellishing many of the complaints made by folks. I don't think anyone is expecting the SP3 to be some sort of LAN party master, but many, and I think rightly so, expected at least on-par performance to the SP2 (they may have been dreaming of something a bit better... but at least equal).

That being said, will Broadwell be better than the Haswell in this respect? I don't know, but I'm going to guess it will come down to what is the true limiting factor on the SP3 today. If it's only thermals, then perhaps it will help. I haven't really done enough investigation to know personally. When I personally mean future silicon, I'm not speaking directly of Broadwell or any specific thing... more of the idea that efficiencies will continue to be improved and speeds in these space constrained devices will continue to be grown as a result.

 

[EMINENT]

I've had the SP1, S2 and now the SP3. I found the overall size of the first 2 gens. to be quite compact and nice, but limiting especially in portrait. The new size and stand are amazing improvements. I think an 11 incher would be perfect as SP3 can be a bit comical in comparison. The performance for me is more than acceptable as i'm not a gamer. I would like to say I need the graphics power to one day do gaming on it, but it's just not something I expect out of this type of machine give the current state of chip technology.

I'd say, if you want and need this form factor and lightweight portability, you will love it. Just like others have said, if you expect the ultimate gaming machine, you'll be setting yourself up for disappointment.

 

[kristalsoldier]

The i7 SP3 will be my first Surface PC. I've lurked these forums for the past month and I must say that the amount of negativity concerning SP3 is a bit alarming. I'm a multimedia artist (premiere, Photoshop, flash, etc.) and the SP3 looks to be what I've always dreamed of. I find myself counting down the days till release. Anyway, it seems to me that the negativity surrounding SP3 is coming mostly from former Surface users (sp2, 1). Is that a fair assessment? As a new Surface user should I be concerned? I'm replacing a Samsung rf510 with a 1st gen i7 and a CyanogenMod HP Touchpad. I'm excited about the upgrade but this forum is bumming me out. Is this the most active Surface forum on the net? I also check out Surfaceproartist. Thanks!

Yes, because it is indeed true that the users of the previous iterations of the Pro line - SP2, in particular - were expecting an "upgrade" in spec and design. What MS started selling from July 20th was an "upgrade" in design only for many. So, disappointment - more so because of the improved form-factor of the SP3!

Another point: Strange though it may seem, no one quite seems to know precisely why MS released the SP3 at this point in time. Is MS serious about being a "devices and services" outfit, paradoxically, like Apple? Or, is MS veering towards the Google model of releasing a set of reference designs across form-factors? What is the future of the Surface line?

No one is really complaining about the hardware of the SP3, save for the fact that the new form-factor, in one stroke, makes irrelevant the essential peripherals of previous two generations - chargers, docks, pen technology, cases etc. Naturally, for those who have invested in the Surface line across generations this disruption is potentially an expensive one. Not surprising if folk are not happy about this state of affairs.

However, I should add that there is another set of users - those are coming to the Surface line with the SP3 and those who are moving from the Surface RT line to the SP3. To them, all things considered, the SP3 is proving to be an excellent device - though an insight into the history of the future of the SP3 and the Surface line would make me feel even better!