Microsoft announces the Surface Laptop and Windows 10S

[macmee]

It is free to upgrade to Pro till the end of the year, if you upgrade after it will be $49USD. This competes against the MacBook and Google Pixel Chromebook. If you are looking for Tablet or Hybrid you are not the market - this was targeted at people who want a traditional laptop and judging from the reactions of Brad Sams, Paul Thurrott, MJF and Donald Rubio even Joanna Stern - its a hit.

People keep saying "it's free to upgrade until the end of the year" but that's just a few months away. I am worried we're going to live in a future where Windows 10S will be the default so that we either have to pay $50 for every new Micro$0ft/OEM device we buy, or live in their prison.

Also I wouldn't call it a success just yet. Most people I've spoken to are skeptical over it as well. For me it's mostly just the 4GB starting RAM and lack of USB-C that bothers me for the high entry price.

For K-12 school's I believe they will always be able to upgrade for free. Others will have to decide sooner, which most likely someone would know when they buy it whether they want full or S version.

I am more angry at the $50 OS upgrade than anything else. Microsoft is regressing back to when they had 7 different versions of Windows, and where they hold your hardware hostage until you pay more money just to be able to use what you rightfully own from the first place.

If someone was mad about Apple locking binaries down on iOS then I can't see how they could be okay with Microsoft taking a step towards a closed ecosystem as well.

I think it's incredibly dangerous for consumer freedom that Microsoft is following Apple and pushing for a closed binary ecosystem. Battery life and security be damned, you shouldn't be allowed to hold hardware I paid for at ransom.

 

[macmee]

I would love if every college student inked in OneNote - truth is I work with so many millennials who I've converted to using OneNote but all of them type in it...

I always took hand written notes on my surfaces, and the Surface Laptop makes that impossible since it doesn't have a 180deg hinge, right?

 

[convergent]

For the majority of users, a closed system is much safer and reliable. Windows is a hot mess for the computer illiterate masses that would be better off with a Chromebook. My neighbor is one of them, and I look forward to the day that they don't keep shooting the selves in the foot and wanting me to bandage it up. Those are not the folks on this forum.

 

[macmee]

For the majority of users, a closed system is much safer and reliable. Windows is a hot mess for the computer illiterate masses that would be better off with a Chromebook. My neighbor is one of them, and I look forward to the day that they don't keep shooting the selves in the foot and wanting me to bandage it up. Those are not the folks on this forum.

Sure, but that's no excuse to charge us $50 to opt out of their jail imo.

 

[hughlle]

Sure, but that's no excuse to charge us $50 to opt out of their jail imo.

Nobody is forcing anybody to do anything. Why should they not be allowed to charge for a piece of premium software? Last time I checked windows 10 wasn't free.

 

[convergent]

And there is an option, at least for now, to upgrade to full Windows 10 for free. Options are good and having spent a lot of time in the Apple walled garden, I like having the choice.

 

[macmee]

Nobody is forcing anybody to do anything. Why should they not be allowed to charge for a piece of premium software? Last time I checked windows 10 wasn't free.

Sure they're forcing you. Just like Apple forces its phone users to only get apps from its app store. They're forcing you because the alternatives either don't exist at all on those platforms or cost you money in Microsoft's case now.

And yes W10 isn't free, because part of that $1,000 price tag is paying for Windows. So why should I have to pay for it *again*?

And there is an option, at least for now, to upgrade to full Windows 10 for free. Options are good and having spent a lot of time in the Apple walled garden, I like having the choice.

We probably shouldn't bring Apple into this because this is an instance where Microsoft has gone full Apple. The Surface Laptop is a nice looking under powered expensive machine with a built in walled garden.

For the same price you can even buy last year's MacBook which has a better resolution, *double* the ram, it's thinner, and it's not running a locked OS.

 

[hughlle]

Sure they're forcing you. Just like Apple forces its phone users to only get apps from its app store. They're forcing you because the alternatives either don't exist at all on those platforms or cost you money in Microsoft's case now.

And yes W10 isn't free, because part of that $1,000 price tag is paying for Windows. So why should I have to pay for it *again*?

No, part of the price tag is for windows 10S, if it is even included in the price at all. Nobody is forced to buy a windows 10S laptop. I don't understand the issue. If you don't want 10S, don't buy something with it. It has always been the case that there are different types of OS at different prices. Windows pro costs more than windows home.

 

[macmee]

No, part of the price tag is for windows 10S, if it is even included in the price at all. Nobody is forced to buy a windows 10S laptop. I don't understand the issue. If you don't want 10S, don't buy something with it. It has always been the case that there are different types of OS at different prices. Windows pro costs more than windows home.

Yes I wont buy it, and I think a lot of other people wont buy it either because it sounds like a slightly less bad Windows RT to me.

Also IMO this is different than just Home vs Pro. One version lets you run any app you want and one version does not.

 

[convergent]

Sure they're forcing you. Just like Apple forces its phone users to only get apps from its app store. They're forcing you because the alternatives either don't exist at all on those platforms or cost you money in Microsoft's case now.

And yes W10 isn't free, because part of that $1,000 price tag is paying for Windows. So why should I have to pay for it *again*?

Apple is not forcing anyone to buy anything and neither is Microsoft. You are arguing about something that clearly isn't targeted at you as a customer. I would dare say none of the target customers for this product are on a Surface forum. The OS is targeted at K-12 schools for administrators to buy and deploy in their school for K-12 students. My personal opinion is that it will also be attractive for non tech savvy users that really shouldn't even be using Windows... this might allow them to safely work in that space.

We probably shouldn't bring Apple into this because this is an instance where Microsoft has gone full Apple. The Surface Laptop is a nice looking under powered expensive machine with a built in walled garden.

For the same price you can even buy last year's MacBook which has a better resolution, *double* the ram, it's thinner, and it's not running a locked OS.

The specs to me look pretty close to what Apple is pushing in their MacBook and seems like a decent machine. I think that people are getting confused because of the way they announced the hardware and OS together but to me they are completely separate things.

Yes I wont buy it, and I think a lot of other people wont buy it either because it sounds like a slightly less bad Windows RT to me.

Also IMO this is different than just Home vs Pro. One version lets you run any app you want and one version does not.

Any app you want might be different from any app other people might want. There are a lot of people out there that run a browser, the office suite, and email... and nothing else. A Chromebook is perfect for them... and millions of people are buying them. How else would you suggest Microsoft play in that space. Surely running Windows 10 Pro is not the solution. My neighbor is a perfect example of why not. Google is doing Chrome totally running everything in the cloud; and Microsoft is trying a different approach by creating a walled garden desktop OS. As I said, choices are good. Not sure why this is a bad thing that there are choices.

 

[macmee]

Apple is not forcing anyone to buy anything and neither is Microsoft. You are arguing about something that clearly isn't targeted at you as a customer. I would dare say none of the target customers for this product are on a Surface forum. The OS is targeted at K-12 schools for administrators to buy and deploy in their school for K-12 students. My personal opinion is that it will also be attractive for non tech savvy users that really shouldn't even be using Windows... this might allow them to safely work in that space.

The specs to me look pretty close to what Apple is pushing in their MacBook and seems like a decent machine. I think that people are getting confused because of the way they announced the hardware and OS together but to me they are completely separate things.

Any app you want might be different from any app other people might want. There are a lot of people out there that run a browser, the office suite, and email... and nothing else. A Chromebook is perfect for them... and millions of people are buying them. How else would you suggest Microsoft play in that space. Surely running Windows 10 Pro is not the solution. My neighbor is a perfect example of why not. Google is doing Chrome totally running everything in the cloud; and Microsoft is trying a different approach by creating a walled garden desktop OS. As I said, choices are good. Not sure why this is a bad thing that there are choices.

Wont k-12 folks be more inclined to buy something cheaper like a Chrome Book still? You can get laptops for less than half the price of the Surface Laptop that should be alright for schools I would imagine.

In terms of the specs looking pretty close to what Apple's offering.... well, the 4GB ram base is really hurting my head. You can get a MacBook for the same price with 8GB. 7th gen intel is nice, but I'm not sure it will be a big benefit. Anyway the big thing for me was no USB-C or Thunderbolt 3. Wouldn't it be cool to buy a surface and run a dGPU off it? Blah. I guess this is probably wishful thinking.

Also I'm not trying to say "my apps are the right ones so since I cant use them in 10s it's bad". I'm saying, in a Richard Stallmen sort of way, that locking down a machine in this way is very anti-consumer and on principle I don't like it and think it isn't free enough. I try to stay consistent on that and I don't like how Apple does it either in iOS.

 

[CrippsCorner]

Don't forget $180 Windows 10 S machines are coming... the Surface Laptop is the Chromebook Pixel of laptops. Definitely not for everyone, but is for someone like me who wants a premium (Microsoft made) laptop who'll chuck on Windows 10 Pro straight away!

The 8Gb model is out of my price range really. I could stretch to it, but my 4Gb Surface Pro has seen me absolutely fine over the past 4 years; I've never really wanted for me. So I guess it should be fine for my usage (nice to have the cheaper option anyway)